Ep 46 | WILLIAM BENEDICT Transcript

Ep 46 | William Benedict Transcript

Before we begin this podcast, please be advised that the following episode contains language that some listeners may find offensive and inappropriate. The opinions expressed by the host and guests are their own and do not reflect the views of the podcast producers. Listener discretion is advised. This man was someone that I really truly cared about, loved, you know, and seen him as my father, seen him as my dad.

Springfield and the surrounding area used to be known as the m*** capital of the United States. Less water than that, throw in the mix, it would explode like the bombs over in Iraq. He looks me in the eye, then he looks over at Mom's house and he says, "Boom. And then you and her are gone." That's when the reality hit me.

And I was like, "Oh my God, we can't keep letting this go on." I never did no s*** like that. Never. You are now listening to the podcast Voices of a Killer. I'm bringing you the stories from the perspective of the people that have taken the life of another human and their current situation thereafter in prison.

You will see that although these are the folks that we have been programmed to hate, they all have something in common. They are all humans like us that admit that they made a mistake. Will you forgive them or will you condemn them? They are currently serving time for their murders and they give us an inside glimpse of what took place when they killed and their feelings on the matter now.

Here are the voices of those who have killed

On this episode of Voices of a Killer, we meet William Benedict, a man whose life has been rocked by the intersection of m*** and mental illness. This story takes us back to the 2010s, when a thriving m*** scene in Missouri was curtailed by law enforcement. Around the same time as this crackdown, William found himself deeply implicated in an operation that seriously threatened the safety of his family.

Today, William walks us through the events that followed that eventually culminated in his incarceration in a Missouri prison. We'll hear about the mental cost of an unstable childhood and the lasting impact of intergenerational mental health issues. We'll also learn about his complex dynamic with the victim of his crime, somebody who brought both stability and chaos into his family home.

While personal and tragic, this episode also critically examines the flaws in media representation and sketches the landscape of small scale m*** production that still haunts the state of Missouri today. We'll piece together the many factors that built up to the moment William pulled a fatal trigger and changed the trajectory of many lives.

So sit back and listen closely as we turn back the clock 15 years to one fateful day on this episode of Voices of a Killer. Hello, this is a prepaid collect call from Billy, an offender at the Potosi Correctional Center. This call is from a correctional facility and may be monitored and recorded. You may start the conversation now.

Is this, uh, William? Yep, this is William Benedict. So I just looked at your, uh, your case, kind of a strange deal, man. How much of it is accurate? Well, okay, believe it or not, it was a small town, so there were a lot of people that wanted to write untrue statements. You know, they wanted to say things that, you know, I think just because, more or less, oh yeah, just wanting to be a part of something.

They like to even create more drama in small towns. Yeah, well that's part of the reason I do this, because a lot of s*** just out there is inaccurate. It doesn't mean everything is, and it doesn't mean you're some kind of innocent man, but we want accuracy. We want to know the truth. You know what I mean?

So, William, where are you originally from? Okay, originally I was born and raised till I was 12 in St. Louis, Missouri. I lived in Ferguson. How was your childhood? How would you explain your childhood? It was a really good childhood. Most of the time, well, I was raised by a single mother, but she would have boyfriends off and on.

You know, so I had stepdads here and there, and, you know, unfortunately, the one, I'm in here, you know, committing the murder against was a stepfather of mine. Yeah. So did you... you saw abuse from your mom's boyfriends or stepdad? Well, yeah, I mean, thankfully, none of them, most of them weren't physically abusive, but they, they definitely knew how to be mentally abusive.

And she had a multiple personality disorder. Yeah. You know, she was also codependent, so she, you know, her having a boyfriend in her life, you know, she felt like she had to, or in her mind you know, it made her feel better, feeling like someone was there that she could always rely on, whether she could or couldn't.

Yeah. Do you still have a relationship with your mom? Yes, she passed a few years ago, though, unfortunately. She had a heart attack, and, yeah, that devastated me because You know, a big part of why I'm here was protecting her also. You know, and fortunately, you know, I was hoping to be able to be out there and take care of her before she passed.

She passed actually at a young age, so she was 55. Whenever you were, you know, like an adolescent and stuff, did you start getting into drugs and drinking and stuff? A little bit. Yeah, a little. Yeah. Growing up, like especially growing up in the city like that in Ferguson, the first thing I did, believe it or not, it, at a young age, I was seven and I first smoked marijuana 10 miles north of downtown St.

Louis lies the suburb of Ferguson. Today, the town is best known for a string of riots in 2014 that tore Ferguson upside down after the fatal shooting of 18-year-old Michael Brown by police. But before this period of unrest the Ferguson William knew was a town undergoing change in the 2010s. It was a former middle class town that was crumbling into urban decay, plagued by drug use, unemployment and crime.

Here against this backdrop, William lived with the central figure in his life, his single mom. Growing up, William lacked a consistent father figure. And instead, he faced a revolving door of his mother's on and off boyfriends. Transient and manipulative, these figures swept into his household only to vanish again quickly.

Such unstable family dynamics can be tough for a young kid to grow up in, leading to long lasting psychological effects. In fatherless homes, children typically suffer from a fear of abandonment and trust issues, along with mental health struggles, like depression. This was true for William too, as his upbringing manifested in his own psychological hardship.

So William, your case, this whole thing is kind of surrounding you attempting suicide, and I'm not ready to get into that quite yet, but my question about that is, do you suffer from mental illness? Off and on, yes, ever since I was younger. You know, and I think part way, that was kind of somewhat a hereditary thing, because there's mental issues on my mother and my father's side.

How about suicide on their side? Yeah, off and on. Yeah, my mother, she also, you know, as I was growing up, she did try to commit suicide a couple times. How would she attempt that? The one time she laid in the road, I guess, you know, hoping to hit by a big truck. Watching that, somebody that, you know, you know that she cares about you, you care about her.

And it's, you know, a bond between a mother and a son are pretty deep. What's that to witness that your mother wanting to leave this world and leave you behind like that? Oh, it's devastating, you know, or to even just for the simple fact of seeing her and going through that with her. Yeah. So, how old were you when you first saw your mom try to, you know, commit suicide?

She never was completely out in the open about it, especially when I was younger. So I guess I was in high school before she ever, you know, let me see her at that breaking point. High school? Yeah. Junior high or high school. Yeah. And after that, you did witness that and kind of gather together, you know, how your mom's mental state was.

Did you start to kind of manifest that in yourself, you know, hey, I'm half of my mother, you know, I've got her blood, you know, maybe this is something destined for me too. Did you kind of feel that way? Oh, yeah. Well, I mean, you know, when I see her going through so much, and then also me, but believe it or not, us having that close of a relationship, at times, what kept us from actually carrying out something

to that extent was, you know, we didn't want to hurt each other. We wouldn't hold back from doing it for ourselves. It would be for, you know, I wouldn't do, I didn't want to leave her like that, behind like that. She, you know, vice versa. And I guess sometimes that'd be my breaking point. But believe it or not, the one time she laid in the road hoping to get hit by a, you know, a big truck, like an 18 wheeler, her boyfriend at the time, the one that I'm in here over murdering, actually, you know, went, got her out of the road, talked her out of committing suicide, you know, and that's why I say I have a lot of guilt and resentment because this man was someone that I really, truly cared about, loved, you know, and seen him as my father, seen him as my dad.

Generational mental illness has hounded William's family, with William himself grappling with mental health issues from an early age. This can be traced back to both of his parents. Most notably, William's mother suffered from a dissociative condition called multiple personality disorder. Sufferers create two or more separate identities to cope with profound trauma, and this can lead to detachment from reality, memory loss, and sharp mood swings.

On multiple occasions, the condition pushed William's mom to the verge of suicide. Imagine how William navigated all this as a kid. William recalls the protective instinct he shared with his mother, where their love for each other acted as a deterrent against carrying out extreme suicidal thoughts. For a son who had a close bond with his mom, her suicidal moments must have been deeply traumatic to watch, and acting as his mother's primary support system. And of course, there's the one and only, William's stepfather, Roger McNeil.

Roger was one of the many stepdads who stepped into William's life, but unlike many before him, Roger seemed to genuinely love and take care of William's mother. One moment in particular sticks out in William's memory in which his stepdad intervened in his mother's suicide attempt as she lay flat on a busy road.

As William describes it, his stepdad was somebody he could rely on to care for his mother during times when William could not. So how old are you right now, William? I am 34. And how old were you whenever this crime took place? I was 21. And the victim in your case, you said it was like a father to you. It was your mother's boyfriend or husband?

My mother's boyfriend. How long did you know him? I want to say four or five years. Yeah, I know him for four or five years because believe it or not, I built a friendship and a relationship with his family before him and my mother ever got together. Oh, so you knew him prior to them getting together? Yeah, yeah, because his sons and his grandson I actually hung out with and rode dirt bikes, four wheelers, and you know, went fishing, swimming at the rivers, and went to drive-ins, you know, so we actually, we had a close bond before all this.

You know, they were family to me long before my mother and him got together. How is your relationship with them now? Believe it or not, I've even been through prison and jail with some of his direct family. Yeah, I actually hear that quite often actually. Yeah, like his son, me and one of his, we had a smoking room in county jail.

And it was like, I want to say it was a ten by ten foot room square that didn't have a roof on it. It was a concrete room where we'd sit on milk crates and smoke cigarettes. That was our little break time. And yeah, one of his sons was right there. You know, after this, and we're sitting there, and we actually had a talk, and believe it or not, there was no major animosity over the situation.

More so, there was just us sitting there, talking, and the guilt that I felt. You know, I was pouring out to him, you know, and, and the fact that, see, because I had a mental breakdown two days before I caught this murder, they had cut me loose out of a mental institution 'cause I was dealing with a lot of stress, a lot of stress, and I just, everything had built up so much.

Well, to fast forward, my stepdad... My mother and I, really my mother would have kept him there, but I kind of ran him off the property. I told him, you can't do what you've been doing here no more. You can't be here no more. Well, okay, he was a m*** cook. That was his whole thing, was he cooked m***, you know, and he was trying to utilize our land, our property to do that. You know, that was his base of operation. He was trying to, you know, and I put my foot down. I was like, nah, you take that somewhere else. I know, I understand that's what you do, but you gotta, no, because you know, you, you're putting us in danger and you'll get everything we've ever worked for and owned took from us.

What was his reaction to that? Angry. He didn't like that because, you know, he wanted the control of everything so he could keep doing what he did because where we lived, we weren't into that at first, you know, because, yeah, we wasn't trying to live the life like that. You said "at first". Did you end up cooking m*** with him, or you end up doing m*** with him, or what?

Yes, yes, both. And I regret that too, because at the end of the day, it came down to a point where, you know, everything he was involved in, this was his life, this was his line of work all, all throughout time. I didn't know that until later on. But, at the end of the day, it came down to either, you know, my mother wanted to be involved in it too, you know, I'll keep it real.

That's why I'm being, I'm going to be all the way honest on all this. Once she was involved in it, she enjoyed that part of the life, you know, there for a while until it got too chaotic, too stressful, too much going on, and we didn't get our door. What made the situation chaotic and stressful? Well, too much

attention, too much traffic, just so much going on. At one point, there was, like, up to 16 people on the backside of the property cooking all at once. Yeah, so, and that's when the reality hit me, that's when the reality hit me, and I was like, oh my god, we can't keep letting this go on. William's relationship with his stepdad was complex.

Their two families went way back, with William hanging out with Roger's sons and grandsons, driving dirt bikes, and swimming in rivers, long before he ever struck up a relationship with William's mother. As a partner, Roger took good care of his mother's well being. For William, he was more than her previous boyfriends.

This was somebody that he knew, trusted, and respected. However, after Roger moved in, it became increasingly clear that his stepdad brought trouble. William's stepdad illicitly made and sold m*** from scratch and eventually he set up his m*** operation at the back of the property where the family lived.

At first, the operation didn't bother William. In fact, William and his mother embraced the venture and became actively invested in the homemade production of m*** and the lifestyle that came along with it. But over time, the severity of what they had gotten themselves into dawned on William. As up to 16 people set up shop in William's backyard, the m*** production started escalating out of hand.

No longer was this a casual makeshift affair, but a full scale procedure with plenty of traffic in and out of the yard, carrying a higher risk of detection. William realized that he and his mother had implicated themselves in a highly dangerous situation that could jeopardize everything they had. At this point, he reached the conclusion that enough was enough.

Give me an idea of what that looks like. 16 people cooking m***. I mean, is it the shake and bake? Is it the...? Yeah, it was the shake and bake. What town was this in? It's actually Centerville, Missouri, but I graduated out of Bunker High School. What year was this? Okay, I got locked up, I think, 2011. I want to say this was like 2009 or 2010.

We'll say 2010. Is this before the Missouri state laws, like, kind of changed everything where you couldn't get pseudoephedrine and all that, one of the main ingredients for m***? No, to an extent, because you, this was even then, they did start restricting where each person had to go and sign, have their ID, and would only, if they bought more than two boxes a month, it would red flag, and then they, you know, they'd start coming to your door, directly to your house, you know? Yeah. So I do remember when I moved to Missouri, it was like really, really bad m*** and it was all the shake and bake m*** and they were really trying to change some laws to get it to where you couldn't just go buy a pseudoephedrine because if you could get a pseudoephedrine, everything else was just, you know, a couple of ingredients here and there and you're cooking m*** and everybody's high as a kite.

So, and it's supposed to be really, really dangerous cooking this stuff. Are y'all doing this indoors, or trying to do it outdoors, or what? Either way, indoor or outdoor. When there were 16 of us out there, we all, we were doing it outside. But yes, to an extent, it is extremely dangerous. Yeah, once you got everything in there, all you gotta do, all, it can take less than a, you know, like the soda cap that goes on the bottle.

Less water than that, throw in the mix, it would explode like the bombs over in Iraq, you know? Like IEDs. Did you ever watch anybody screw up and it just, you know, blow up or anything? Yeah. Yeah, well, my stepfather showed me one time how dangerous it was. That's how I know this, how much water, all it took was a little bit of water.

He's, "Okay. Watch this." And he poured just a tad bit. I mean, it could have been, more or less, it was, it didn't even take a full soda cap. There's about a quarter of a soda cap full of water he threw in there and he barely got the cap on by the time he threw it and it exploded. It was an explosion about, I mean, blow up a car.

That's crazy. Yeah. I mean, and like I said, when I, when I moved to Missouri, there were people like U-Haul vans blowing up at intersections because people were in the vans driving around trying to make it and s***. I mean, it was really, really, bad at one time in the state and for people listening, you know, Springfield and the surrounding area used to be known as the m*** capital of the United States.

Just crazy, crazy. And then I guess when they cracked down the pseudoephedrine, that's whenever the Mexicans started making all the ice and stuff and the, and it kind of made it to where not as many people were cooking it. Would that be accurate? True. Very true. Yep. Roger's m*** operation came at a critical time in Missouri history at the time.

The state was facing a historical crossroads in the battle against m***. In the early 2000s, the homemade m*** industry was thriving in Missouri, earning the state the title of the M*** Lab Capital of the United States. Makeshift labs sprung up in remote areas of the state, where people scraped together the ingredients to brew their own homemade m***.

This coincided with rising unemployment as many sought to make ends meet through their own backyard m*** production. Yet, 2005 saw a state crackdown on m*** production. One of the main ingredients in m*** is pseudoephedrine, a chemical that is conveniently found in nasal decongestants. To combat this, a law was passed that put limits on how much of the drug could be purchased, mandating ID checks, and placing decongestants behind the pharmacy counter.

This put the brakes on the makeshift labs operating around the state, and lab seizures shrunk dramatically. But although producing m*** dropped, m*** use did not. Mexican drug cartels seized the gap in the market and stepped in to supply stronger doses of m*** through their existing distribution channels.

Another solution to the crackdown was the emergence of shake and bake methods of m*** production. This quicker method involved mixing m*** in 2 liter soda bottles, making it portable and easier to evade law enforcement. However, this method was incredibly dangerous, as one simple error could cause an explosion, leading to serious burns, chemical poisoning, or death.

Given the context of the time, William's stepdad was playing with fire by setting up his m*** operation. At the height of the state crackdown, in a suburban area, he was putting the family at great risk of detection, and William knew it had to stop. How would his stepdad take the news? After the break, we'll hear about the confrontation that took place.

Yeah, and did you basically put your foot down and be like, "This is all done now"? Yeah, finally I did that. That's when the reality, the full extent of what was going on hit me. So whenever you approached him and you're like, "This is it, we're not doing this anymore", tell me about his reaction again. And did you approach him or did the whole group or your mom or what?

Well, I approached him, me and him, by ourselves. And I said, "No, no, we can't", this was after You know, because I was a part of this too. You know, I'm keeping it real. I, you know, once, once he opened us up into that world, I decided, okay, this is my mother's boyfriend, you know, this is me and him, we had a bond by then, you know, we worked on vehicles together, you know, ATVs, dirt bikes, we built things together, we all worked together and, you know, built up our property, the houses, the shed, you know, we did everything together, you know, created a home.

But then, after we were comfortable, that's when everything started to happen. And then, the reality of it was there were 16 in the back, right behind the houses. You know, there was 16 of us doing this. And it was like, that's when the reality hit me, oh my gosh. And this is already after, you know, I was in high school with the DEA.

The whole sheriff's department kicked in our door and tore up our property. See, I had my own trailer. It was a 16 by 60 mobile home with two bedrooms, two full bathrooms. I owned it myself on my mother's property. It was 30 feet away from her house. And from the time I was 15 to 21, I owned that. It was in my name and everything, because I worked on a farm to be able to save up, and that was, you know, one of the things that I earned by working on that farm.

Did anybody get prosecuted when the sheriffs came? No, no, because actually, after that, it wound up being illegal search and seizure. There were a lot of discrepancies due to the search warrant and everything. Did they find m*** making? Well, I mean, no, believe it or not. No, because this was a little before all that.

Yeah, it was a little before all that, that they kicked in our door before everything really got going on, you know, him opening us up to that world. What did they find? But they did... they found marijuana pipes, you know, and bongs, and they, I had a dirt bike in the kitchen of my trailer, took apart, the motor disassembled and everything, on the dining room table, because I was rebuilding the motor, engine and everything, and it was legal, everything we had was legal, because we legally owned, earned, you know, we buy, sell, and trade vehicles, four wheelers, dirt bikes, you know, all that.

So, but they swore everything was stolen or it was bought with drug money and it wasn't. You know, we earned everything legitimately. So that's what they were tripping on. And when they figured out everything was legal, we even had land deeds, titles for every shed, every house, every vehicle on the property, everything was legit.

They realized, "Oh crap. Okay. We're...", and this was before everything amped up though. But yeah, when there was 16 back behind the house doing this is when the reality hit me, "Oh my gosh", by this time I'm already graduated high school. So I realized, well, this can't happen no more. His reaction was, he gave me a serious, direct look.

Like, okay, like, he wasn't ready to go for that, you know? Wasn't on board? No, no, he wasn't on board with leaving, you know, because he already felt, this is his, you know, this property and everything is his. He set up shop, you know, his too, you know? And I also had a car accident back in '08, and he was the one driving and I almost died in it.

It was him, me, and my mom in the vehicle. We lost our brakes going down the hill and hit a tree. And, you know, I got a plate, eight bolts in my right femur. The whole length of my femur because of the car accident. And to an extent, I worried at first that it might have been a purposely thing to try and get me out of the way.

You know, maybe that was a little bit of paranoia. But also, this makes me feel bad too to this day, because the jaws of life, the fire truck, they all, the police, all them, they couldn't get me out of that vehicle. They had already had him arrested for being the driver with no insurance and everything. So they let him out of the back of the cop car because the tow truck he had had the chain hoist and he directly

helped get me out of that vehicle. The fire truck and the jaws of life and everything wouldn't have been able to do that without him. So he literally saved my life there. And that, you know, really redeemed him at the time. This was before I decided to put my foot down and decided, you know, "Hey, you can't do this on our land no more."

Ultimately, he gave you a look like this is not going to happen. Did a fight ensue, argument or what? A little bit of an argument, but he, more or less, it was a serious look like, "Nah, that ain't happenin. I ain't playin that." More or less, you know, and then he said it was him and my mom's decision whether he leaves or not, too, you know?

So, when I was helping him load the last of his stuff in his vehicle to get him off the property, that's when he had a pistol in his hand. It was a double barreled '22, over and under. And he's explaining, "All I gotta do is pull the hammer back, boom," and he looks me in the eye. Then he looks over at Mom's house and he says, "Boom.

And then you and her are gone", you know, and looks me dead in the eyes serious. And this was a month before this happened. That's why I wound up in a mental institution and everything cause I couldn't handle the stress. I didn't know what to do. So it was built up where you thought, you thought that one day he was going to come get you and shoot you.

Absolutely. And it sounds like you were and you did end up being able to get him off the property though. You said you were helping him load stuff. So you actually did succeed. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So that was the last report me and him had before I went to the mental institution and everything was helping him load

the last thing was his cutting torches. What was your mom's reaction to you getting him off the property? Well, believe it or not, she, I think she was at peace. Because she was upset at first, you know, because I think in some ways she still wanted to live that life, you know, but at the same time she knew she didn't want, she'd been telling them that she didn't want that done on the property, because they could take our property for that.

They could seize everything we own for somebody doing some crap like that on the property. When Roger's m*** operation intensified, William hit a breaking point. Although he had initially been an active proponent of the m*** production, he realized that it had to come to a stop for the safety of himself and his mother.

After all, a prior incident at the house stuck in the back of his mind. Police officers had raided the property in search of evidence of drugs or stolen goods. Though this was before the m*** operation had fully kicked off, and although officers could find no incriminating evidence, the incident left the fear of discovery

close in William's mind. Although he cared for his stepdad as a father figure, and he owed him his life after saving him from a car crash a few years back, William made the difficult decision to kick him and his m*** operation off the property. His stepdad didn't take the news well. A .22 pistol in hand, William's stepdad pointed the barrel at him,

then turned towards the house where his mother was, warning William that he would shoot them. Although Roger eventually complied and left the property, the gesture sent William into a spiral of paranoia, afraid that their lives were in danger if his stepdad chose to return and retaliate. Under the immense stress of this threat, William wound up in a mental institution shortly after.

What caused you to go in distress this day of the murder? Okay. There was so much going on. There was a lot of tension. Like I said, two days before that, I got out of a mental institution. Okay, and what caused this distress, the witness against me pulls up on the four wheeler. He's drunk, belligerent, you know. So, then my stepfather pulls up, and as my stepfather pulls up,

the friend's all, "Get it ready, get it ready." Like he was, the friend was acting like my stepdad was going to transgress towards me, so that put me on high alert. Where are you at at this time? Are you sitting in a vehicle? We were outside my vehicle, standing outside there, me and a friend that pulled up on the four wheeler.

On your property? No, no, we were on the side of the road. It was on a side road, probably a mile away from our property. Are you like upset crying at this point or saying, "Hey, I'm going to kill myself"? Yeah, I was in distress. I was having a mental breakdown because for one, you know, after my stepfather threatened me and my mother with a pistol, this is something she didn't even know.

You know, so. With a weapon? Yes. What was it? It was my legal millimeter. It was registered in my name. Were you putting that, your own gun to your own head and saying things like, I'm going to kill myself? I wasn't saying I was going to kill myself or nothing, but when they pull, when the friend on the foiler did pull up, yes, I did have it to my head because I was at my breaking point.

What did they say whenever they saw that gun to your head? Well, the friend on the four wheeler, he ended up creating a situation, wanting to argue, get belligerent, and more or less, you know, cussing, you know, just, it wasn't even a situation until he started creating even more stress. Is it just your stepdad, you, and the guy on the four wheeler?

Just that's it? Well, at that point, it was just me and the, when I had the gun to my head, it was just me and the friend on the four wheeler. When he pulled up I had the gun to my head. I was laying, I was sitting on the hood of my car. And so he goes belligerent. How long after that does your stepdad pull up?

Maybe five minutes later, he pulled up. Does he see you with the gun to your head? No, I don't believe he seen me with the gun to my head. It was mainly the friend on the four wheeler. So you'd already took the gun down from your head at that time? Yeah. What did your stepdad say whenever he pulled up?

He wasn't even talking to me. He started talking to the friend on the four wheeler. About what? I don't know because, well, for one, I got a hearing problem, you know, my hearing is bad, and, you know, and I was a little distance away. I was about 10 feet away from my stepdad's vehicle, so he, the friend walks over and they're talking. Well, I see my friend start emptying his pockets, put his cigarettes on the hood of the car, on my stepdad's car and all that. And this is after, I don't know, it's after my friend said, "Oh, get it ready, get it ready." Like I needed to have my gun ready in case something happened. Is it the guy on the four wheeler or the guy that emptied his pockets? The guy on the four wheeler's the same guy. He's the one that emptied his pockets while he's talking to my stepdad.

And you felt like that was get ready, like somebody's going to do something, you better defend yourself? Yes. Okay. Yes. What happened after that? Okay, what happened after that was all I could hear is mumbling between them two, like they were talking. My friend, he was right there at the driver's door, my stepdad's vehicle.

It was a vehicle he borrowed from somebody or something. Anyway. So next thing I know is, you know, I hear a little quick talking. The talking go like a little quicker, okay, and I see my stepfather, his left arm jerk up real quick. He's sitting in the driver's seat and I seen it jerk up real quick, you know, and I was afraid he had that pistol in his hand.

And I was afraid that was, you know, he was getting ready to shoot me. Honest to God, right here. Were you high on m***? No. No. 'cause I was two days out of a middle institution. I wasn't even. I was just... I was mentally unstable at the time though. And like in the reports you'll see that there was a gunshot wound through his forearm before it hit him in the chest.

It was one shot. How far was he from whenever you shot him? Roughly 8 too 10 feet away. And what was his posture like? Was he walking towards you? Was he standing there? Was he yelling? Was he pointing at you? Was he...? What was he doing? No, he was in the driver's side of his vehicle. And like I said, his arm come up real quick and I was afraid he had a gun in it so I pulled the trigger and the bullet went through his, the front of his forearm, come out the back and then hit him in the chest and it tumbled and hit him in the lung and that's how it killed him.

So do you think your stepdad was there to do something to you? To this day, I think it is a possibility, yes. So I gotta stop you for a second. You know, this is exactly why I do this, because if you look at your case on the news it almost sounds like this guy that you killed is a random guy who's a good Samaritan that was just trying to help you from committing suicide, and that's the end of the story.

I know the newspaper's come out. That's exactly why I do this, because I f***ing hate the news, man. And it doesn't mean, it doesn't mean that you're some innocent person. That's not what I'm getting at. No. I want to know the f***ing goddamn truth. Okay, here's another thing. Okay, there's also specifics that can be pointed out about this case.

Do you know what he got caught, or do you know what they found in the vehicle with him the night that this happened and you know, that I had shot him? And he had two active m*** labs in the floorboard of the vehicle he was in, and enough supplies in there to do 10 more labs the night that this happened.

Look up William's case online and you'll find only a few articles about the details of that night. Even more frustrating, the articles that do exist misrepresent the events of this case. They fail to adequately contextualize the relationship between the two. They portray William's stepdad as a good Samaritan who is trying to talk a stranger down from suicide, and they exaggerate details stating that William jumped on the hood of a car to shoot Roger.

It's a perfect demonstration of the problems with media. The news favors simplicity and it thrives on telling narratives about heroes and villains. The reality of the situation, however, was much less cut and dry. At the time, William wasn't thinking clearly. Freshly out of a mental institution, he was having a mental breakdown that night.

And when he pulled up at the intersection of Y 72 and Route B in Reynolds, he was threatening to shoot himself. A friend arrived, but rather than calm things down, he only escalated the situation and when William's stepdad pulled up, the friend told William, that Roger was carrying a gun. It's impossible to know William's stepdad's true intention, but given their last threatening conversation, William's thought, real or perceived, was that he had come to harm him.

On edge, William saw his stepdad's hand jerk up. With adrenaline pumping and thoughts racing, William convinced himself that he was about to be shot dead. Acting on instinct, William shot first. The bullet passed through Roger's forearm before hitting his chest and striking a lung. The night had been shrouded by mental confusion and fear, causing William to make a tragic, split second decision in the heat of the moment.

Now his stepdad lay dead. After the break, we'll hear about the aftermath of the killing. So whenever you fired that gun and it hit him, what was the very, very next thing that you did? Did you stay pointing it at him and yelling or did you go look to see if he's okay? What was the very next thing?

No, I panicked because I didn't know what to do and the friend on the four wheeler, he jumped on his four wheeler and took off immediately. And I'm still there, and I'm not knowing what to do, I mean, for a split second, I wanted to stay and see if he was okay, you know, or what the situation was. Did he slump over, or was he struggling to breathe?

He got out of the vehicle, and, yeah, he slid down the, no, he didn't say, I don't recall him saying anything. But he got out of the vehicle and slid across the side of it. Whenever he got out, did he look at you or he didn't say anything to you? He just got out and slid over and fell? Yeah. Yeah. Any, I mean, he looked at me, but you know, I don't recall him saying anything.

What was the look on his face when he looked at you? Like, I can't believe you did this or help or what? Well, it was also dark too, you know, so I really, I can't recall too much. I wanted to stay and assess the situation because, you know, I wanted to check and see if he had a gun and at least assess the situation, maybe even get the gun out of the way or what, and then check on him, but everything happened so quick, I didn't know what to do, you know.

Whenever he fell, did it look like he had fell, dropped dead, or was he struggling on the ground? No, it didn't look like he dropped dead initially. He just... from my understanding, I think when he got out of the vehicle, he slid, and from then on, I don't even, I'm not sure because I'm still trying to assess the situation. But you know, when it comes down to fight or flight, I didn't know if he still had the gun, or if he had a gun, because I swore he had a gun.

The way his arm come up, that's the only reason I pulled the trigger. Well, all this kind of makes sense now, because y'all kind of had a point of contention with you telling him he can't do that anymore, and there's arguing, and then your friend thinking that you thought he said that he had a gun, so now it kind of makes sense to where he wasn't really trying to stop you from committing suicide,

it doesn't sound like. He, maybe he was gonna, but he just, you know, just looks like a lot of, it sounds like a lot of confusion on what you perceived was going to happen and you fired a weapon. You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah, there was. How long did you stick around after he fell over? Not long at all.

Cause you know, like I said, I didn't know if he still had a gun or what the situation was. Where'd you go? I just went driving, you know, I took off driving. Just not knowing what to do, you know? Where'd you drive to? Well, I started off, I ended up going down a side road, like a gravel road. And then after that I came back around to kind of, I backtracked, you know, and by that time I seen an ambulance coming.

So I went ahead and kept driving. And shoot, I wanna say I almost drive all the way to Ironton, toward Ironton area, but I got pulled over and arrested. Did they have guns drawn and everything? Yeah, yeah, they had their guns drawn and all that. Did he pass away pretty quickly or did they say he was dead?

Yeah, he passed away pretty quick. What was your mom's reaction to you killing her boyfriend? Oh, I mean, she snapped. Yeah, she was, she was upset at first. I mean, well, because I never, I didn't fully explain to her his threat toward us. So did they ever find a gun on him? No, no. No, there was a lot of bullets to every caliber gun in his vehicle with him and everything, but they never did find a gun.

Yeah, whenever you got arrested, did you tell the authorities basically everything you told me? No. No, I never even brought it out in trial, or I didn't go to trial. I pled guilty. But I never brought any of that out because I didn't want to tarnish my stepdad or blemish anybody's character. I felt I'd done too much damage already because I hurt a lot of people, you know, we had his family, my family, the ripple effect was just unbelievable, you know. Yeah, he was even a grandpa, he was a dad, he was my stepdad, my mom's boyfriend. Me and him both have a lot of people that care about us. On the night of the murder, William left his stepdad slumped over and bleeding on the ground next to his car, though still alive.

When William sped off, Roger succumbed to the bullet wound and died shortly after. Within minutes, William found himself driving up towards Ironton only to be caught by a police blockade and taken into custody. To William's credit, he has always remained honest about his guilt, choosing to plead guilty and not take the crime to trial.

At his sentencing in 2012, William received a 25 year prison sentence with the possibility of parole. Initially, William's decision to evict Roger was to keep his family out of trouble and to stay on the right side of the law. It's a tragic irony, then, that this very incident sparked events that landed William behind bars, the unforeseen circumstances of his actions.

So you got your sentence and you went to prison. How's that been for you since, being in prison? Oh man, it's been a reality check, you know, and I realized coming to prison, you know, we realize that everything's stripped from us, you know, and everything I ever worked for, and not just me, my mother... I've done more harm with all this, you know, okay, yeah, it is possible that me and my mother could have been killed if something like this might not have transpired, but at the same time, who's to say?

We'll never know, and, you know, if I could, I'd take it back. I would take that chance, and I wouldn't have done this. I've been in here, I've been locked up... May 10th is the day this happened, and that'll be... it's either 12 or 13 years it went by. This happened 2011, so... Yeah, my math skills aren't the greatest, but yes, it's 2000...

So it sounds like, would it be accurate to say here in about 5 to 10 years you'll go for parole? Yes, 7 years I see the parole, 6 or 7 years I see the parole board. How do you think that's gonna go for you? Truly, I don't know, I mean, I've stayed out of trouble enough, I haven't been in no serious trouble in here.

You ever find yourself in fights? Yeah, I've been in a couple. Mainly one that they, it was obvious, they caught for. Me and a celly of mine got into a fight. This was at six months after my mom passed. I had a mental breakdown in here and me and a celly fought. Yeah. But I've been in probably two or three, three, probably three, maybe, you know.

What are most of your fights about? Believe it or not, mainly with cellies. Yeah, trying to live with somebody? Yeah. Well, like I said, this is exactly why I do this because literally when you read the news or, you know, articles on you, it just sounds, they make it to where it sounds like a good Samaritan that you didn't know was trying to stop you, help you from committing suicide and you murdered him.

Wow. Yeah, it's crazy. And like I said, I don't do this to try to get guilty people found innocent. I do this to kind of shed light on all the inconsistencies that people in the public hear. It's like the news wants people to be misinformed about absolutely everything just so they can get a news article out.

Oh yeah. Yeah. There were people that wanted involved on this. They could have got me at first, I was initially charged with first degree murder because people wrote statements saying that I put a gun to his head while they were loading scrap, and I pulled the trigger and it just clicked, and I said, "Next time there was gonna be one in it."

I never did no s*** like that. Never. You know, and people concocted a story like that just because they I guess we're, and this was long after the murder. This was like months after the murder. They decide to write statements like this, and yet, that could have got me death row executed in here. You know, just statements like that.

Which, by the way, you are in a prison where a lot of death row inmates are. Do you, are you housed in the same housing unit as death row inmates? Oh, yeah. Yeah, they run, and I've been cellies with a few over the years. And, yeah, we're right around general population. Right amongst them, and that's what's wild.

That's what's made this somewhat difficult, because we see... now, some of them, yes, they haven't, some of them haven't got any better. They're, a small percentage still are terrible people, okay? But there's a good percentage of that really show change, and they've made strides compared to whatever crime they did.

I've been here going on 11 years with these guys. I've seen probably 20 of them executed, or more since I've been here, and got to see the change in them. Got to know them personally. Do you think they should have been executed? A good percentage of them, I'd say 50 percent of them, no, no sir. No. Why's that?

Because I mean, at the end of the day, what does that do? You know, I mean, yeah, okay, yeah, they might have killed somebody or done something brutal, but at the same time. Okay, when the crime is fresh in their mind, okay, this person just killed somebody, okay, do you think it's not right to give, to sit that person on death row for 20, 25 years where they've had the full opportunity to change and become a better person?

If they're gonna execute somebody, I think they should do it when the crime's still fresh in their mind. They know what they did wrong, which they still know, but I don't know, it just, you know, I got a lot of opinions on that. It is a big point of contention in our country. The thing is, is that we all have to say, you know, what if that was my loved one?

And usually the answer is kill that motherf***er. You know what I mean? But true, but also like street justice, right? Right. But also, you know, like whenever it comes to judges making decisions and all that, they're supposed to do that without emotions. And that's why we don't do it like that, that's, you know, we let people that aren't putting their emotions in their decision, so. But I'm indifferent about it, because I think that if somebody hurt one of my children or something like that, I would want the motherf***ers dead too, you know what I mean, but, you know, so it's just the way it is.

Prison has been a reality check for William. Behind bars, he's been stripped of the life he built and worked hard for. And he's lost valuable moments with his mother, who passed away a few years ago. It's interesting that William's life has been marked by more than one brush with death. In high school, he watched his mom attempt suicide on a major road.

As a kid, he survived a near death experience in a car crash. And now, he's found himself in a housing setup where he regularly interacts with death row inmates. This has given William a unique vantage point from which to reflect on the complex issue of the death penalty. His opinions are clear. He thinks it's unethical and inhumane for a person to face long periods on death row, and he attests to the fact that inmates can transform positively and become better people during their prison terms.

Prison has also given William plenty of time to dwell on his own guilt and regret for taking Roger's life. In our conversation, he recognizes the pain his actions have caused, and he seems genuinely remorseful for the lives of the family members that have been unnecessarily hurt by the shooting. During his childhood, William knew Roger's family very well, begging the question, has he found any opportunities to reconcile with them today?

I know that you said that you'd ran into one of his family members in jail, did anything happen in the courtroom, or did you get hate mail or anything like that? No, no, I mean they, the motion of discovery, you know, they felt that I should have got, you know, the rest of my life in prison, and in some ways, yeah, I feel so bad that I feel that maybe this 25 years I got isn't enough, you know, because I took someone's grandpa, you know, someone's boyfriend, someone's son away from him, you know, and he had a lot of times where he was, he was a good man, you know, I loved and respected him.

I have so much guilt. Like, especially one of his sons that I, one of my victim's sons that I became real close to. I honestly, if I seen him out on the street, I would throw him my personal gun and put my hands up and let him decide what he thinks, sees fit. You know, because I would give him that decision in his head because I just I feel so bad and, you know, the guilt eats me.

Honestly, I don't think he would. But I would give him that option and fully be okay with whatever decision he made. You know, I've had my brother, or I had an adopted brother out there, they've met up with, what's wild is there isn't a whole lot of animosity. You know, it's like they have forgiveness in their heart.

You know? Well, it just sounds like a mixture of drugs and, you know, mental illness and, you know, wrong decisions on, and split decisions with wrong ones, you know, just all of it culminating to something really bad happening, which is somebody dying. Well, William, it's been an experience talking to you. I'm glad I got, you know, all the information, and maybe now people can listen to this and see that the news really does suck.

So, you know, at the end of the day, you still took someone's life, but just not under the circumstances that we thought by reading the articles. Again, I appreciate you allowing me to interview you, and if you ever need anything, man, just give me a call, okay? Okay, I appreciate you big time and you know, cause I, you know, I got nothing to hide.

I'd rather the truth be out there so there's closure too, you know? Before I let you go, what would you say to anybody listening that has struggles with mental illness? Oh, don't be afraid to ask for help, you know? It really is, you know, the people that care about you and know you best probably can help more than anybody else, you know?

I appreciate you, okay? I appreciate you too, big time. Okay, man. Take it easy. Yup. You too. Bye bye. The caller has hung up

On the next episode of Voices of a Killer. As far as your story goes, you're literally an innocent man that just didn't tell. Apparently they were having meetings on killing this guy and all of them knew about what was fixing to happen. You're talking about a military trade man here. He's trained in this kind of stuff.

I'm spooked. I'm like, "Hold up, what the f*** just happened?" As far as I can remember, like I said, we were both in it. We were both there. We both were part of it. Man, things would be so much different in your life right now if you'd have ran out of that house. Actually, I started to laugh. You laughed at him?

Because I knew there was something more. I've always had hope that there's something more. That's a wrap on this episode of Voices of a Killer. I want to thank William for sharing his story with us today. His ability to be open and honest is what makes this podcast so special. If you want to listen to these episodes weeks in advance, you can now do so by joining our Patreon at https://www.patreon.com/voicesofakiller. There you will get access to raw interviews, unseen news coverage, and unique correspondence with the guests of Voices of a Killer. Head over to https://www.patreon.com/voicesofakiller to support the podcast. Your support is what It keeps us passionate about bringing these stories to you.

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I'm your host Toby and we'll see you next time on Voices of a Killer.